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PGP BREXIT | BRITISH NATIONAL IDENTITY CRISIS – INTERVIEW WITH AN ORDINARY BREXITEER [CENSORED]

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PGP BREXIT | BRITISH NATIONAL IDENTITY CRISIS – INTERVIEW WITH AN ORDINARY BREXITEER [CENSORED]

Tue, 08/27/2019 - 07:59
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Boris Johnson Brexit Cartoon

Brexit Polarity – A Radical Social Views Exchange – Proud Brexiteer vs Czech Expatriate

Introduction Into The Brexit Issue From A Perspective Of A Globalist

 

Due to the Brexit ongoing events, it has resurfaced that British people have a history of imposing changes on other nations throughout the history of colonisation, but due to the conservative British character, fewer changes happened inland. That is not a negative factor. British are visionaries that gave culture and language to many and continue to lead the worldwide scene, and rightly so. Although, let's not get big-headed.

 

The Brexit National Crisis Since June 2016 - ????

The United Kingdom undergoes a national crisis, while three of four nations are fundamentally opposed to leaving the European Union. The most divided and most significant country, England, had elected government to pursue exit from the EU. The government, irrespective to the other nations, and all EU citizens opposed to its decision continue to exit from the EU at any cost.

Brexit hence threatens the very existence of the United Kingdom. Many Brexiteers believe that Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland need them to keep their living standards. However, nothing could be further from the truth. Wales has deeper historical ties with England than Scotland and Northern Island, and it would be an unlikely prognosis to expect Wales to call for independence. Nevertheless, significant damage to the Welsh economies could be the cause for a public vote.

Speaking of Scotland and Northern Island, the prognosis of the vote for independence is much more likely in the case of Scotland, and similarly, in the case of Northern Island, the likelihood of joining with its southern brothers never been closer in the entire history of their separation; for self-evident reasons in both cases.

 

A Brexit nightmare. How did this happen?

Indeed. How did this happen to the country that always was in the lead of world globalisation, the very instrument of building worldwide economies, the Commonwealth of Nations leader, the empire on which the sun never sets?

 

This article will demonstrate the polarity of English population throughout an interview I conducted with an ordinary and well educated Brexiteer, who is also a second-generation of immigrants from the south of Europe. For that reason, find his opinions even more shocking!.

 

SMS Interview With An Ordinary Brexiteer

 

It all started like this: Me:

Vaclav Havel Grave Brexit

 

"Is that before he p****d on his grave? " I have asked him what does he mean, he answers...

"Not keen on that bloke, seems like something he would do. A globalist lackey if there ever was one."

 

Overlooking the indirect insult to Czech people and their ex-president Václav Havel, I paused thinking. My comrade does not believe in the European dream. Nope.

 

"It is a dream unless you are Greek, Cypriot, Italian, Spanish and Portuguese, then it's a bit of a nightmare. 40% of youth unemployment under 25. It's a failed project I'm afraid."

 

Suspected nationalist/fascist

There are several points I find off-balance with that opinion.

First thought suggests own roots hater. The conversation should be interesting. While entire Europe is working in unity to solve these problems, a person who is 2nd generation immigrant in the UK does not feel enough solidarity with his own blood. Further, the 40% statics is misleading and does not reflect reality. Check the statistics at Youth Unemployment Rate In EU Countries

40% is a misleading figure, simply because one can't put a value against family ties and feelings and dynamics of one's country. I suggest that the parents take care of their young well, while there is a certain level of struggle to find work. Maybe he is worried that with such a scary number of youth unemployment there would come more Greeks into the UK, creating competition for him. Regardless they did not do so to date. Or maybe he is worried that because of all those unemployed young Greeks he is going to have fewer olives on his table. Regardless he continues to have enough olives.

...or maybe he is not happy that he is not wealthier than is currently is and could have more if it weren't for all those blood-sucking Greeks. I think I just hit the spot.

Maybe I have judged him prematurely. The keyword is not 'judgement' it lies in the word 'blame'. People are looking to blame someone for lack of their self-fulfilment in terms of living standards. I am there naively thinking how happy I am living in a society that achieved unity & piece via such a great project as the European Union. As a Czech expatriate, I thoroughly enjoy the freedoms and liberties given by this great EU project, and to me, it is like watching a flower grow. I come from a nation which used to be oppressed by the Soviet rule, and that is also why I value the EU project greatly. Problems are there to overcome a coward runs away from something more significant than them.

 

Brexit Vision of collapsing EU. A nasty divorce?

My Brexiteer friend has a very different way of looking at things...

"There won't be a referendum; there will be a general election and a Brexit Party Conservative pact (after Brecon Powys). If they can't make headway with the EU, then that's where we will be. 

Deutsche Bank is in trouble, and Credit Lyonnais is in trouble, a couple of Spanish banks are on edge. The German Banking Organisation has been in contact with De la Roue (who print notes). They put some designs forward for a new Deutsche Mark, so they are getting ready. 

There lies the problem when you centralise power and prevent the people from having any form of direct democracy in how the things are run. The European Parliament is ceremonial. Sad state of affairs and without the UK's 40 billion a year they are screwed along with the German car market as we are a massive customer of their cars."

 

I find it an outrageous proposal that a British Conservative will form a pack with a Fascist. That is simply not going to happen, mate, I said. That scenario is going to depart England from Scotland and Northern Ireland, ouch the United Kingdom not so united any longer!

 

"That's whats seems to be hinted at. Lib Dems already have done it at it worked. Green party and Plaid Cymry didn't field candidates in Brecon to give Lib Dems a clear run, Brexit Party and Conservatives had more votes collectively. What will happen is they each won't field candidates in marginals to maximise the leave vote. Interesting times."

 

Brexit Revolt

I responded. The UK is a country full of smart people. Voting Farage in general elections is not going to happen. Brexit was a revolt, and so it should remain. I am not going to believe that a fascist stands a serious chance. If he does, I am not wasting any more and get likely out of this place. No one from Europe needs this crap so al Brexiteers and clean up there mess on their own. So not only losing the brand of the United Kingdom but also a majority of foreign workers. That would be like hell yeah, oi Brexit, go England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 back to ’70s!

 

"The problem is we are an island nation with an island mentality. Not that I agree with all of that, but I can see a coalition between them. Corbyn frightens me more than Farage and Boris put together. Don't get me wrong, the EU was a great idea, but it shouldn't have imposed the Euro, the Lisbon treaty was a huge mistake. Making it federal states of Europe would have everyone running for the door. Hitler had dreams of unifying Europe under one nation and one flag and look what happened there."

 

Is this planet 🌏 so big?

"Efficient design means distributing power to the decision making nodes, not just centralising it in one spot. I'm very much a libertarian, small government and freedom for people. I don't see whats happened with mass migration from Africa and the middle east as a success story, especially in Sweden, Greece and Germany. And when the EU Bank does fail, we are on the hook for 200-300 billion in write-offs. Not good as it will fail."

 

Well, it works in the US, Canada, Australia, China, Russia, India... why are we so different? Language surely is not a barrier any longer as English is widespread to the necessary level.

 

"Russia or the USSR, which collapsed under centralised control? The USA didn't have 2000 years of falling out to resolve and two world wars to sing songs about. You can't tether the northern economies of Europe to the southern economies of Europe. It would be like taking a puppy tied to the back of your car down the M1 for a lovely drive. 

 

Brexit divides, the EU includes.

"Negativity is not intelligent. It is always of the ego. The ego may be clever, but it is not intelligent. Cleverness pursues its own little aims. Intelligence sees the larger whole in which all things are connected. Cleverness is motivated by self-interest, and it is extremely short-sighted. Most politicians and business people are clever. Very few are intelligent. Whatever is attained through cleverness is short-lived and always turns out to be eventually self-defeating. Cleverness divides; intelligence includes."

― Eckhart Tolle, A New Earth: Awakening to Your Life's Purpose;

I want to second that and say that we are here to observe by experience. That’s the only purpose. The mind, god, or anything anyone calls it only cares for balance. Negativity is not inteligent, but you can’t have Ying without Yang; you can’t have balance without suffering you can’t have evolution and search for perfection without suffering. We are subjected to automated beliefs systems in search and test what is ideal. You can’t know what is ideal if you did not experience what is not. You only know what you experience is ideal by the end of any suffering in you. At that point, you had fulfilled your purpose for which you were created.

 

But what about the Italians? And the Germans? I-Uscita & D-Ausfahrt?

Cultures are not the same and asking an Italian not to be Italian anymore but be a European just like his German brother is utterly impossible. Scratch the surface and have a look at the puzzle piece into which the EU fits. It is a much larger project than just Europe. Plus why when Ukraine voted for closer ties to Russia a few years ago did the EU spend 4 billion funding Neo-Nazis and Poroshenko to overthrow the elected government? Not something that we need to be a part of. Independent nations are cooperating, and trading is a much better prospect.

 

Again, it's a failed project; it just doesn't realise it yet. Also, with what is coming down the line after the initial exogenous shock to the economy, I think the UK will be booming. We are already outperforming other major EU players with GDP, and that's despite all the doom news."

 

A beacon for democracy

 

"Wow Al Jazeera is usually a beacon for democracy, I mean Doha is famous for its libertarian views 😁.

 

Brexit Impact On the Union of Great Britain and Northern Island

So Scotland wants to manage its affairs. They want to remove themselves from the Yoke of London and restore power to Edinburgh and rightly so. But they are resisting the right of London, restoring the power from Brussels and manage its affairs. And when Scotland gets its independence, they want to run right back to handing control over to the EU?

There is a broader problem that no one likes the tories, including me (but they seem to be good at running things). As opposed to the Socialists that can't seem to run a bath. 

Finally, we have the problem of democracy and that we have had 300 years of self(ish) rule. We didn't go through dictatorships and communism that featured in Europe's history, and if the votes of 17.4 million people are ignored, there is going to be trouble. The UK has always been a strong union, but the Scottish despise the English for putting down the rebellion that saw them unifying with the French to seize the crown. The Irish have been split down the middle between the UK and Eire unification for 120 years and the Welsh, well they f*** sheep for pity's sake!😀

I'm sure it's going to chaos for a month or two, but we are resilient."

 

Good political debate, love that! Though, you are hitting the wrong spot mentioning USSR to a Czech. 😁 Crimes committed by USSR vs efforts to join Europe in unity are two different ballparks, to put it mildly.

 

Brexit Disrespect for minorities

I stopped earlier at your explanation of the difference. Funny that who feels different. Let me be blunt here. Northern Ireland, Scotland or Wales do not want Brexit or voted for it in the first place. Entire Europe has a poll to mirror the British vote, with results between 70-99% for the EU. Only England 50/50. I don’t understand why the English feel the need to impose their values and endangering the Kingdom’s unity with the arrogant prick of Boris the not so great.

 

So what’s going to be left from the UK at this rate is the flat English part of island full of fields so people can start feeling proper different. That’s bloody nuts. I don’t feel different from a Greek or anyone else. And think of it I am a resident in this country for 16 years. Should I have not right to vote to UK parliament or in referendums? I don’t but so I should, and too right! And so the millions of others. This Brexit nonsense would not ever happen with EU permanent expats voting, so tell me where are my human rights. Just because I was born somewhere else, it is not good enough reason. I think I start a quick petition to invalidate the Brexit vote on those grounds. 21st century and the hell with minorities! God save the Queen. Brexit is known to be the symptom of high blood pressure, 10/10 GPs recommend to keep calm & carry on!

 

Will God or Brexit save the Queen? Or Corbyn?

"Lmao love it mate. Yeah, its all a bit f***** up really and yes the other lands didn't vote to leave, but that wasn't what was asked. 

I thought you got a vote if you lived here, Radek? The whole of the EU's voting structure is mirrored from the old Soviet system, i.e. appointing the supreme soviet as opposed electing them. Perhaps a bad analogy with Czech.

I quite like Boris, he's better than Corbyn, who is a Marxist from the core. No one got rich from Socialism, apart from Maduro as well as his daughter.

I think the UK will stay together, Ireland, Wales and Scotland are all busts. They need the people that make money to keep them in Beer and Leeks. De facto, Yorkshire has a bigger GDP than Scotland; perhaps we should declare our independence. 😀"

 

Who is after the Welsh sheep? How does Nigel Farage like his sheep? Does he have one? Will the sheep also Brexit?

The petition will resonate in the farthest corners of Northern Ireland, the highest mountains of Scotland and the deepest valleys of Wales. 

"Those Welsh valleys are deep mate, lots of sheep f****** going on."

They say that about Italian too. But now it’s the English who want to f*** with the Welsh sheep. 😂

"indeed!!!"

 

I shared the Brexit petition with him.

View & Sign the petition

 

"By that same token was the Lisbon treaty also illegal as that removed state rights and was done without consultation? Don't think you will get a lot of traction with this as Article 50 was triggered. It was tested in court by Gina Miller and her European backers. Also resolved legally, but Parliament had to have the final say which they haven't been able to do? But I am no lawyer.

 

Its also ironic that whenever I talk to someone pro European, they never tell me how amazing it's going to be when we federalise. How wealthy the whole of the EU will be and how better mine and my children's life will be. They tell me how appalling it will be when we leave. It's like there isn't a real argument for the EU.

 

The second ironic thing is we trade 12% of our GDP with the EU, and we trade 88% of our GDP with the rest of the world. Our most significant trading partner is the USA, and we don't have a trade deal with them, absolutely zip. Its all done on WTO rules. So I'm not entirely sure when they use such emotive words are crashing out, cliff edge, leaving without a deal etc. They are there to make people fearful, and it works.

 

Waste of resources on government structures

The other EU members seem to enjoy the fruits of the UK's success; we are the second biggest net contributor behind Germany. The 26 billion or so a year makes up a good chunk of the costs of running the place. So instead of laying new bridges in Spain and building roads in Hungary, we can spend that on our crumbling infrastructure and hospitals in the country, which was earned.

 

Evergreen Brexit & NHS topic

The NHS under the freedom of movement has become an EU health service; being pure saps, we are free at point global health service. When you have a scarce resource, you either charge more or ration it, and it becomes rationed. 

 

Brexit & Homegrown Vermin

All this, in theory, will stop on October 31st. Perhaps, we can introduce an Australian points system, so people coming to stay here have a skill. A job and can support themselves, and make a positive contribution such as your good self. We have enough homegrown scrounging bastards without looking after someone else.

 

I think the EU are frightened of having a prosperous independent nation on its doorstep and will do anything and everything to sabotage our success.

 

We have Brexit, and a big button as well!

Finally, peace in Europe, well once they dropped the nukes on Tokyo in 1945 that pretty much ended all world wars to be fair. We are a nuclear power and a member of NATO, so that has probably done more to keep the peace than disarming Germany.

Pick holes in any of that and please make a convincing argument for more closer federal Europe."

 

The 3.7 mil EU Brexit wrinkle

EU citizens denied vote in European elections to sue UK government

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/25/eu-citizens-denied-vote-in-european-elections-to-sue-uk-government

"Just a wrinkle, I'm sure."

Hmm 3.7 mil wrinkle 😂

"well, a bump in the road then lmao 😁"

 

A third party bumped in giving us few side-tracking jokes:

Why does Britain like tea so much? Because of tea leaves. lol

What did Britain say to its trade partners? “See EU later.”

Brexit was like the UK got drunk and accidentally unfriended Europe on Facebook

How did the Brexit chicken cross the road? "I never said there was a road. Or a chicken".

 

Me:

Brexit Tower

 

"lol... how's overturning the democratic will of 17.4m people going lmao 😂

We have nukes, you know! 😁

British Expats can't vote in Spain. Logically, your argument extends to the whole of EU's elections, which based on your claim are racist and invalid, such as the British elections. British citizens who live and pay taxes in Spain have their lives affected but have no say.

How much of the EU constitution did you actually read? I don't rate your chances mate, sorry but we are going, and there are many places to live in 27 other countries that are staying if you need EU laws to keep you happy. The British government, however, had said they would enshrine EU citizens rights in law so not sure what the crack is?

A lot of respect for you trying fella 😁"

Brexit === British Radical Exit – Abandonment of democratic principles

How about the 73% that do not want 'no deal' and 55% that would vote to remain anyway. Is it democratic not to be allowed to change your mind? England, 21st century, no respect for minorities that included all other UK countries. But one thing I learned on Facebook groups. Brexiteers are unable to listen to the reason and are super thick for the most part! Why would we tell people how everything is going to be perfect in the EU. It is going to stay as it is. All that Brexiteers have is a plan to exit. Nothing beyond that, and the majority of those voters to remain will have to fix their s***.

 

It’s not about a vote but a public vote. There is a significant difference. Let me ask you which voting option is closer to the Brexit referendum, municipal elections or general elections?

 

No answer.

Consequence of Brexit - WTO Tarrifs

Brexit WTO rates

 

Then all Brexiteers can go to Aldi and Lidl; it is cheaper anyway.😁

 

Brexit and Racism? Let's not 'buy' the stats!

"Nah I don't buy that at all to be fair. No one can sell the EU on a positive footing as it hasn't got one. We haven't delivered on the last referendum before we ask again. The plan was as always to blur the lines, delay and frustrate push to vote yet again. It worked in Ireland. 

And also I don't buy the stupid racist argument.

Problem is they asked the question in or out. It was not specified whether out with a deal or out with no deal or out with a withdrawal agreement or out with it. Binary and in the most crucial exercise of democracy in the UK's history, we voted to leave. So we should leave as the s**t is out of the horse and no amount of debate is going to put it back in.

So when we do leave, people have the democratic right to campaign for rejoining if it's not working out. Until then suck it up buttercup I'm sad to say."

 

Hmm, not to mention Lidl, too affected by the WTO tariffs on German food that German import here as they would not eat it 😆

 

"Ah scare stories, it's bullshit, we can eat chlorinated chicken 😁 I think you have a chronic deficiency in critical thinking and an oversupply of rant. Still, have a lot of respect for your determination, however."

 

Is Nigel Farage a Chinese princess on a pink Brexit horse? Daft, Dangerous?

It all about respect, but don’t have the time to explain the workings of economics. You don’t have to buy it, but the information about WTO tariffs is freely available online. You can verify that and bounce back on me without doing research. It’s what I said, Brexiteers don’t care about reason or the facts. They choose to remain ignorant of the facts, i.e. faith will provide. Anything I am going to say it’s not going to sink in — last one you don’t buy the racist argument. Ok so according to you the 30% who voted Farage, believes that he is a Chinese princess on a pink Brexit horse?

 

I can't speak for people who voted, only myself. I did the 1st year of an Economics degree before I switched fully to software engineering. I understand the current state of the EU northern vs southern states is untenable and when it goes (and it will) we need to be untethered from it. 

Sorry to disagree, but my lack of faith in the EU comes from the 1990s. Yep, tariffs will be slapped on as a punitive measure, and yes the EU would instead bankrupt the German car industry than moving an inch. So let's get on with it and see where the dice falls.

 

True we pay for our southern brothers. But the keyword should be a solution and leadership, not a bunch of separatists that run before the problem and think they will be better off. Entire Europe got a huge chunk of that with Arthur Neville Chamberlain.

Also, it is not a punitive measure to apply tariffs. The UK does not want to contribute to the EU treasury, and it is unable to make a deal. So without an agreement, it is not possible & fair to the others to have free tariffs for free.

It’s also not about walking away. Why should I? In 16 years am I as good as native? But I also don’t want to live it the place when 30% of people became fascists by voting a fascist. So I am all keen to see the general election as still hoping Brexit party is one-off gig & revolt. I think Scotland will be a great choice if Brexit happens they will be back in the EU in no time.

 

Brexit share of wisdom

"Problem of course for the EU is we take more products of theirs than they do of ours, so tariffs are just going to spiral the EU's issues. Regardless that all Scotlands funding models need the price of Brent Oil at $150 a barrel to make independence work. Scotland would be bankrupt in 18 months from going it alone, and they wouldn't meet the economic tests as a country to join the EU. 

 

The EU doesn't need another net recipient, so I don't think Scotland is going anywhere in a hurry. Incidentally, Yorkshire has a higher GDP than Scotland. Don't let any of that get in the way of peoples ambition to split the union up. Free Trade mate, the way to go. Lastly, I love Europe. What I don't need is a supra-state that is one more step on the road to global governance. The EU is f***ed if we make a success of it and they know it. 

 

Supermassive Greek Brexit Blackhole

Sixteen years is a long time, try 48 and paying a fortune in tax for the last 30 to see very little of it spent on my local economy. The thinking now is it's too late to stop us leaving on the 31st. 432 MPs voted for it, so blame them."

 

Did vote on what? As as I recall, there is an impasse, and the MP will never support a 'no deal' scenario or the scenario of the only deal. So unless Boris wants to bypass Parliament and have 5th of November in style, I don’t see any chances of Brexit happening anyway.

 

Major Brexit Betrayal

The Brexit repeal bill will remove UK citizens' right to sue the UK government. There is clear evidence of far-right influence on the government. The bill is removing the fundamental human right of citizens' to take legal action against the government. It is an act of treason done by fascist that does not act alone. The preposterousness of such a proposal is astronomical.

UK Citizens are being prevented from sueing the government.

 

WTO tariffs & Autocratic system with no accountability

"Voted on triggering article 50, which started the process. MPs should not have voted for article 50, and the whole thing would have ground to a halt. They voted for A50 because they were assured that Teresa May would stitch up the UK and keep us in via BRINO. 

Problem is Article 50 in-law states we leave on 31st of March; they voted to delay until 31st October. No one needs to prorogue parliament as the default law is unless another law is passed to delay again then we leave on WTO rules. However, now the Speaker seems to have been reigned in and Jacob Rees Mogg is in control of backbencher legislation. He effectively controls the parliamentary timetable, and they have to break through him to get it solved. That's what they mean when they are doubtful it can be stopped.

That's correct as we won't be under the jurisdiction of EU law, seems perfectly sensible to me. Under the old WA, we would adopt all EU laws in the interim. The EU's style of negotiating has pretty much pushed us to present a deal to parliament that could not be voted through and as such we are here. So probably need to blame the EU as much as our lot for lack of progress.

This democracy stuff is a pain in the ar** isn't it; it's like two wolves and a sheep voting what's for dinner. What we need is a top-down autocratic system with no accountability, elections or recourse to get things done, oooh that's the EU, isn't it? 😁"

 

That’s total gibberish. The attempt cannot be retrospective, I.e. has no stance against times UK were meant to abide by EU laws. It would be like committing a severe crime and by the ability to change the law, go free tomorrow. Talking about autocratic, Boris Johnson the Great. The first British (oops English) Supreme Chancellor.

 

A big Brexit brother Echelon – Government Spying Program

Sending a link... https://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/11/07/british_government_spying_on_lawyers/

 

"Mate it's all tapped, everything, its called Echelon. Old news that is, brother. What do you think FB, Google and Instagram are built for? We have no privacy; it died about 20 years ago. We ruled the world for f***'s sake, did you think we did it by being nice? We lost the empire overtly, we just went covert and said leave the whole money and information thing to our chaps."

 

That's is why British not ruling the world any longer, can’t even keep their unity. Common no longer common, and United no longer united. Too many English think they can p*** on other people sand and get away with it.

 

That also transpires in the tourism aspect. There should be warnings signs all over Europe – The English are coming! 

https://www.theguardian.com/travel/shortcuts/2017/jan/17/from-barcelona-to-malia-how-brits-on-holiday-have-made-themselves-unwelcome

 

"I think you have precisely summed up the top .01% of our leaders out there mate, of whom I am (sighs sadly) I'm not a member." I agree we are awful (obviously I'm not) but at least we are better than the Russians or the Chinese 😀"

 

Brexit Hypocrisy

I do not put all in one bag, not personal mate. But there is this trait of ignorance and arrogance and way too much of hypocrisy in this nation.

 

"Entirely agree as a 2nd generation immigrant."

 

Well observed 🙂

 

"And that's why we are the 6th wealthiest country in the world with appalling inner-city poverty and a whole host of horrendous social problems."

 

Brexit & The EU Charter Of Fundamental Rights vs Citizens Voting Rights

 

"Explain to me how you are going to overturn EU law as its the same in France, Spain, Germany?"

 

My petition aims to enforce EU law; the UK did not comply.

 

"Which bit of EU law allows my British expat Auntie to vote in government elections? It doesn't exist, confused mate."

 

Before I can clarify, let me ask you this question again, this is the legal explanation here. To which voting category, you would say that Brexit referendum is closer. To municipal elections or government elections?

 

"It's irrelevant; you are changing a European law that says if you arent a National you cannot vote. Give up your original citizenship, adopt nationality and problem solved. If its a moral crusade then I agree, but it isn't?. Let's extrapolate further. Asylum seekers should be given a vote in Germany, regardless of the fact they are Syrian etc. Is that legal?"

 

I am only trying to enforce what the EU charter says. The UK and probably others failed to implement that. There is no overturn.

 

"So do you agree that every other EU member is also breaking the law?"

 

Get the logic. As a resident in the UK since 2003, permanent resident since 2010 do you want to say I have no right to vote on the public matter? It’s a loophole, and a good one at that, not a directive.

 

"Right, so you will be setting a European wide precedent, agreed?"

 

I'm attacking the fundamental basis of the referendum as a democratic instrument. It is not so democratic if it can deprive millions of citizens of their rights and cause waves of populism and racism against them. Although I did not check the laws of other countries, it may be setting a precedent. Also think of it, which country last time run a referendum on such a scale that would directly affect the lives of expats? I'd say the answer is the UK is the first and there comes the precedent.

 

"So every election carried out in the Eurozone should be rendered null and void by this logic if proved correct and the law has changed.

Ireland voted to leave the EU after the 2009 financial crash. The EU lost by 5%, so after a lot of scare stories, they decided to vote again as the margin wasn't decisive enough. The second vote was in favour of staying, and the margin was even less, 3 per cent (my numbers will be off) They stuck with that through as they liked the outcome. Catalan, same deal, Ukraine is coming up I think."

 

But that is not what I am talking about. But yes, repeating the referendum to give people the chance to change their mind is very democratic.

 

"Choosing which result from listening to is undemocratic; however, implement the first one before you ask again, eh? Why don't we have elections every six months to confirm we haven't changed our mind? The bit you may have missed is the law is blind. You can't selectively apply which bits you use it to which I think you are doing here. You can't say this vote was more significant so its a special case."

 

The loophole is there is not a direct definition. I think it’s there on purpose.

 

"I agree, but if the UK dismisses it which they will, then the EU courts will no doubt not entertain it as it re-writes all sorts of laws. Significant precedents don't sit too well. But I wish you luck."

 

So I can do petitions in the UK, but I can’t vote in the referendum. Aren’t these two the same in their very essence?

 

Well as I understand it, you don't have to live in the UK to sign the online petitions also, another shit show. You mean you could bypass the system if you know how, but the point here my liberties seem to bounce on waves of political convenience.

 

"I think the last petition to leave had 400,000 votes from Alaskan IP addresses."

 

Well, it’s a technical issue, and they surely discounted those. Assuming the government already implemented a country block since then? Plus they are verifying people names and postcodes against the national database so Alaskans can have a lot of fun but without affecting the results!

 

"Nope they counted em, it may have been sorted but the last count of the 5 million votes, 1.2 came from overseas, two from Antartica I seem to recall lol. The voraciousness of our system."

 

I also learned that UK expats it’s after 15 years they can’t vote to anything. How unfair is that so they became de-rooted and can’t vote anywhere, yet still carry a British passport? So are they British citizens or not.

 

"Isn't there a statute of limitations of expats. I.e. if they haven't returned or filed a tax return for let's say eight years and have no have access to the national health."

 

Nope, many EU countries don’t have limitations. For example, Germany had 25 years, which is way more reasonable.

 

"We exported a lot more people though lol"

 

"It is just another opinion piece with no real substance. Don't tell me, Jeremy Corbyn will solve out all problems with his magic money stick."

 

He will not have enough time to screw it up, who is going to vote him anyway. He’s just the lesser evil.

 

Boris Johnson & Nigel Farage Brexit Treason

The solution is straightforward. The English find themselves soon enough again welcomed in the EU brotherhood. I don’t care if Corbyn or Lib Dem’s or an Ape with Banana manages that. Boris Johnson & Nigel Farage should be locked up for treason!

 

"LOL, well its an opinion at least. The whole confirmation bias comes in again, ever heard of cognitive dissonance?" It's an inability to hold two counterpoints of view simultaneously. As such, you only ever listen to items that reinforce what you already think. Ironically I thought the same about your post, but I can quite happily consider both sides." The EU's f***ed.

 

Brexit trading signals

The cognitive dissonance I heard of. It’s not that. Send some proper stuff not a bunch of exceptionally unsympathetic guys, and I shall listen.

Although, if you bet on 'no deal' Brexit, I'm going to give you a trading signal! Exchange all your Pounds for Euro, post Brexit you get roughly 20% profits if not more! 😁

 

Brexit Chlorinated Chicken

And a shopping signal too ... 😁

 

Well, its an old argument but 17.3 million (legal) votes were cast to leave, and we should leave. Fundamentally its a lack of respect for democracy but the EU has no such concerns. It is what it is; I certainly wouldn't buy chlorinated chicken more than I would eat a bratwurst. I'm still waiting for the reasons why we should stay and the benefits of the EU which you were too busy to list but not too busy to spout more s***.

 

Brexit ignorance & assumptions

Mate how you say that is democratic not to allow people to re-vote after years of new evidence & information. That is autocratic!!! Funny the polls are 73% against no deal. What more reason do you need but to keep people in their jobs, food on their table, a roof above their head. How many years do you think it will take the UK to recover? Or are we just having a blindfold on here and thinking yeah keep calm and carry on nothing is going to get hit? Maybe you won't buy the super cheap chlorinated chicken, but people who don’t have money will! 😡

 

"It's a circular argument, get it tested in court, the only way. Again its an EU law you are railing against, but the relevance is lost on you. I haven't seen any evidence that the remain vote has grown, the media has to remain agenda and its just an echo chamber. I voted to leave, and if need be, I won't change my mind because I don't believe in the EU project. If you don't like that then tough s***, I have a different opinion, and for what it's worth I think you are utterly brainwashed by whatever education system produced you. Luckily I deprogrammed myself about 20 years ago, so my blinkers are off. 

 

Will, there be problems when we leave, sure, will we flourish in the future surely. What we won't be is a global benefits system for anyone in the EU that rocks up with their cap out. Is that harsh, no its reality. Read anything Milton Friedman wrote about allowing people who haven't contributed to a system and the resultant effects.

 

That's the last conversation I'm having as I'm bored of repeating my opinion and we are opposed so deal with it.

 

Without any malice, I wish all people like you to hit the ground so hard to wake up. There is no reasoning. The evidence is there for those who want to see it. Deprogramming is good. Blindness is not. Let me put it differently. Twenty years ago, you became a visionary that the EU project doesn't work. Something Nigel mentioned the other day, how many years he worked so hard to Brexit because he had the same vision as you. Ideas are shared. Otherwise, they won't become visions. I tend to be exceptionally careful with whom I am sharing my visions. A fascist is hardly the choice for me.

 

Brexit Oi! Boredom

"No pal, you are the fascist."

"You want to rule by an authoritarian dictatorship without recourse of elections to shift them from power. Given the history of your home country, the only reason you are sat in this country and enjoying its opportunities, it is because of that fascistic communist system. It collapsed, and now you want more. I think your ignorance only eclipses your arrogance. And as I said, bored now"

 

I thought you have some brains but a fascistic vacuum. That runs in the family of Brexiteers too well. The fascist, communist system, what on Earth are you smoking out there! 😁

Opportunities in this country. That’s some proper s***. My belly hurts from laughter – An Idiot Inland.

 

End of conversation.

 

Brexit Should I stay or should I go

 

This article continues in reflection at "WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE BRITISH? | REFLECTION ON BREXIT AND POLARITY IN OUR SOCIETY".


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